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*** Deena_Simester (simester@208.1.87.92) has joined channel #Office-hours
Deena_Sime: Is there anyone out there?
*** Kim_Klein (krklein@du216-105-84-245.chicago.avenew.net) has joined channel #Office-hours
Kim_Klein: hi
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*** Jim_Levin (jim_levi@c574324-a.chmpgn1.il.home.com) has joined channel #Office-hours
Jim_Levin: Hi Deena, how's it going?
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Jim_Levin: Hi Kim.
Deena_Sime: Hello!! This is my first time for office hours!!
Kim_Klein: So, what's the news today?
Kim_Klein: Hi Deena
Deena_Sime: Hello Kim!!
Jim_Levin: Did you see that Margaret Riel is involved with the US Dept of Ed webcast today and tomorrow?
Jim_Levin: (Margaret is our guest speaker for later in the month.)
Kim_Klein: Yes, I haven't had a chance to check her out
Jim_Levin: Her webtour that you'll be looking at is a lot of fun.
Kim_Klein: You posted that in webboard, right?
Deena_Sime: I saw that earlier. I haven't had a chance to look at it. Unfortunately I have to work the night she will be our guest.
Kim_Klein: Or maybe it was an e-mial
Jim_Levin: It was in email.
Kim_Klein: or mail for that matter!
Jim_Levin: We'll "log" the session, Deena, so you can look at it later if you want.
Kim_Klein: For the Sept. 13th assignment...
Jim_Levin: If you have any questions you want to ask, send them to me, Deena, and I'll ask for you.
Kim_Klein: do we just need to pick a site and tell if it fits a constructivist or other point of view?
Deena_Sime: I did bookmark the page and glanced at her White page. I will look forward to seeing the log of the session. If I do think of any questions after I look at the site more, I will get them to you.
Jim_Levin: Its even easier than that. Take the exemplary educational site you found earlier, and match it to the taxonomy.
Jim_Levin: That's the first part of the Sep 13 assignment.
Kim_Klein: the second?
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Jim_Levin: Read the second Bruce & Levin paper and respond to it.
Kim_Klein: in webboard?
Jim_Levin: Then in WebBoard respond to the overall paper, especially the proposed new uses for language arts.
Kim_Klein: okay
Kim_Klein: Hi Nelda
Nelda_Bake: Hi Kim.
Jim_Levin: (I see that there's a sentence fragment in the web page that might be confusing - sorry about that.
Jim_Levin: Hi Nelda.
Jim_Levin: Then you respond to two other students responses.
Deena_Sime: Hi Nelda!!
Nelda_Bake: Hi, Jim. I just have to tell you that coming from a school that barely has a computer lab and just last year became internet ready, it is hard for me to imagine some of the things we have been reading about.
Nelda_Bake: Hi Deena
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Jim_Levin: Well, since you're starting from scratch, you can skip over the intervening stuff.
Jim_Levin: Hi Brian.
Brian_Engl: hello everyone
Nelda_Bake: Good idea, Jim.
Nelda_Bake: Hi Brian
Jim_Levin: Big storms up you way, Brian?
Jim_Levin: (your way)
Brian_Engl: yes
Jim_Levin: Did you get any of the hail they were talking about?
Deena_Sime: Where are you again Brian??
Brian_Engl: I don't think so, it is starting to clear up. Chicago
*** Debra_Brennan (dabrenna@AC81ADD2.ipt.aol.com) has joined channel #Office-hours
Jim_Levin: Brian's about a stones throw from Ohare Airport, right?
Jim_Levin: Hi Deb.
Brian_Engl: correct, Wood Dale
Nelda_Bake: Do any of you find that is very difficult to get your staff motivated to use technology. As hard as our school district is trying, we have many teachers resisting.
Nelda_Bake: Hi Debra.
Brian_Engl: Yes,
Jim_Levin: One approach I've used is what I call the "smorgesbord" approach.
Nelda_Bake: What is that?
Jim_Levin: Spread out as many possible uses as you can, and then go with whatever people find interesting.
Brian_Engl: I ran into a few problems today with frustracted staff. If things don't go perfect, they give up.
Jim_Levin: I remember one teacher who was very resistent until I showed software for tracking antiques. :-)
Jim_Levin: Different people have different entry points.
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Deena_Sime: We only have one computer tech person in our building.
Kim_Klein: Same here
Nelda_Bake: I guess that means we have to become more technolgy literate so that we can motivate others.
Debi: Hi everyone!
Nelda_Bake: We only have one tech person in our district.
Kim_Klein: Hi
Jim_Levin: That can be a problem, but it just means you and the rest of your fellow teachers have to become good at trouble shooting.
Jim_Levin: Hi Debi
Nelda_Bake: Hi Debi
Deena_Sime: It is frustrating to have to wait for help, therefore, many give up on him, and the computers/technology in general.
Jim_Levin: BTW, has everyone been keeping up their trouble shooting logs?
Kim_Klein: that's so true! Some people would rather not use it at all if there is any chance of a problem.
Brian_Engl: A problem faced in many districts is that the so called experts in tech aren't really experts at all.
Jim_Levin: Yes, the other good thing to show folks is what to do if the technology doesn't work.
Nelda_Bake: Yes, I know that is what it comes down to. Our principal is using the you're going to do it whether you want to or not, approach. I'm sure many of you know how well that works.
Kim_Klein: That's true, it sometimes seems that anyone with a tad bit more knowledge of technology is considered an expert
Deena_Sime: I lost my hard drive on my computer at school just two weeks ago. I am fortunate that our tech person also teaches math and we are very close. It only took 1 1/2 weeks to get it fixed.
Jim_Levin: An expert is somebody from more than 50 miles away? :-)
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Jim_Levin: Hi Jim.
Nelda_Bake: Brian, I think that you are right. People are scrambling to find anyone that knows anything.
Nelda_Bake: Hi James
Jim_Levin: You folks better be prepared to have folks consider YOU the technology experts.
Kim_Klein: The experts at my school can't figure out why my 1 classroom computer won't function!
Kim_Klein: It's been over a month now, and they still can't figure things out!
Jim_Levin: That's a drag, Kim.
Nelda_Bake: I don't know how they can expect you to be the expert just because you have an interest in tech.
Debi: Our biggest problem in our school is finding time in the labs. We have electives for Computer Graphics, 3D Design and not all teachers can use the labs.
Deena_Sime: Our first staff development of the year was involving trouble shooting problems on the computer. Also how to install programs etc. I am ready to take on the responsibility, but everything is so secret. Like only the tech person and the administration can know.
James_Bert: Hi, there. I'll try to catch up with the conversation in a minute.
Jim_Levin: How did they teach trouble shooting if they didn't want to tell you any "secrets"?
Nelda_Bake: Everything, is secret, because nobody really knows and they don't want you to know that.
Debi: Our server keeps going down in our building. The district doesn't want to spend alot of money or time on repairs because we are moving into a new buiulding next year. But it still is frustrating.
Brian_Engl: What I have found over the last couple of years is that many districts jump into new technology without first laying the ground work for how they are going to service the technology
Debi: How true.
Jim_Levin: Too true. All the money for hardware, little for software, almost none for infrastructure or training.
Nelda_Bake: My pastor is the Techn Expert in the town that I live in. It is a small school but advanced in tech. He never gets finished.
*** Pei-Szu_Chou (pchou@c140297-c.chmpgn1.il.home.com) has joined channel #Office-hours
Jim_Levin: Hi Pei-Szu
Pei-Szu_Ch: hi all
Deena_Sime: We got a handout with basic information. If I had never been on a computer before, it may have been helpful, but it wasn't anything for me. I think it was meant for those people Nelda refered to that are resistant.
Nelda_Bake: Brian, That is so true. One wonders why they spend so much money without consideration for the other components.
Jim_Levin: The Springfield tech coordinator, Mike Holinga, has been pushing a "rule of thirds".
Nelda_Bake: Deena, I have received many of those handouts and I bet they didn't do you any good at all.
Jim_Levin: One third for hardware & software, one third for infrastructure, one third for teacher training.
Jim_Levin: That seems to work well for that district.
Nelda_Bake: Do you think one third is enough for teacher training?
Debi: I think teacher training is the key. It's built into our annual development plans, but not truly enforced.
Deena_Sime: The handouts were for "dummies".
Jim_Levin: Probably not, Nelda, but its about one third more than most districts devote.
Deena_Sime: Why is that ??
Jim_Levin: The hardware can be seen, the training is invisible?
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Jim_Levin: Hi Jane, welcome.
Nelda_Bake: You are right about that. They were goint to pay our teachers to stay after school to get familiar with the internet. I was going to have to teach them. Blind leading the blind.
Jane_Blant: Hi, everyone
Debi: Hi Jane.
Deena_Sime: But how do you know what the hardware has to offer without the training??
Nelda_Bake: Hi, Jane
Brian_Engl: The last couple of days at school I have been working with administrators throughout my district developing a plan to get teacher training for everyone in the district
*** Signoff: James_Bertelsen (Connection reset by peer)
Jim_Levin: Sounds promising Brian
Nelda_Bake: Deanna, That is the problem we all have. I
Deena_Sime: What are some of the ideas Brian??
Debi: Our district pays a stip[end or allows district credit for training. It's a great plan, but as always, only certain people always apply. Those are usually the people that integrate technology readily.
Nelda_Bake: How can training ever keep up with the changes in technology. For that matter, how can you keep up with the necessary changes in hardware and software?
Jim_Levin: lots of JIT (Just In Time) learning :-)
Nelda_Bake: I was able to participate in a year of working with teachers across the state in technology. It was my choice to apply.
Brian_Engl: I think it is important to first train teachers with the basic skills that seem to be useful for years and years
Jane_Blant: a one time training just doesn't cut it either - it should be continual ongoing training - I know, who has time or money for that
Deena_Sime: How does that help when it seems that the students are always a step ahead to start with??
Jim_Levin: Deena, you need to draw upon the students expertise.
Nelda_Bake: I really believe that a lot of the kids will take off on their own with a little guidance from us an then they will learn to problem solve.
Jim_Levin: That's why the new technologies encourage problem/project oriented learning & teaching.
Nelda_Bake: I think it is a little difficult for teachers to let go . They always want to be in control and this is giving up that role and becoming a facilitator.
Jim_Levin: That way, the kids learn, teach each other and the teachers, while the teachers coordinate/orchestrate the whole thing.
Jim_Levin: I sort of like the "orchestra conductor" metaphor.
Jane_Blant: Jim, I had a ? on one assignment - When we log in as guest on the Language Arts paper, how do you know we posted a comment?
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Pei-Szu_Ch: I gotta go, but I want to have tonight's record. Where to get one?
Jim_Levin: You need to change "guest" to your name on the comment.
Jane_Blant: I tried putting my name and it wouldn't let me in
Jim_Levin: I see that Pedro or Constanza instituted logging, but I haven't heard yet where they've put the log.
Jim_Levin: Jane, I meant, log in as guest, but when you make a comment, change the field where it says "guest" to your name.
Jane_Blant: ok - got ya
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Jim_Levin: Pei-Szu, I'll send email about where the log is.
Nelda_Bake: If we have already made a comment, can we go back and add our name?
Jim_Levin: Hmm, I don't think so, Nelda. Just send me email saying which comment is yours, and I'll fix it in the database
Nelda_Bake: Ok
Jim_Levin: (ie. the paper is in a web-accessible database)
Jim_Levin: What do you folks think of that interactive paper format?
Debi: It took me a while to get used to the format, but the more I use it, the more I like it.
Nelda_Bake: It seems a little foreign to me but I think it is a good idea.
Jane_Blant: kinda neat - the one thing that makes you really think about all this is that anyone ( well almost anyone) can read your work!@ sometimes that's scary
Deena_Sime: I like it, even though I haven't reacted yet. It would be easier if it wasn't so long. I was trying to read the whole thing, then go back to comment, but my eyes really started to hurt.
Nelda_Bake: You are so right, Jane.
Jim_Levin: We're exploring a variety of uses for it.
Jim_Levin: Yes, reading on the computer is a strain. Have you all figured out that you can increase the font size in your web browser.
Jane_Blant: I ran it off - easier for me to read on paper....
Nelda_Bake: I think if you look at commenting on just part of it , that is easier.
Kim_Klein: I love the format
Kim_Klein: In fact, I'm reading it now
Jim_Levin: I do that more and more, as my eyesight gets worse and worse.
Debi: That's the problem I had too. I wanted to re-read so I could process another thought, and found it a little foreign at first.
Jim_Levin: You know that you can either see all the comments along with the paper, or just the paper, right?
Nelda_Bake: No
Jim_Levin: (the "linked" vs. "inline" comments view)
Debi: No.
Jim_Levin: Up at the top, there are several choices of how the "view" the paper.
Debi: Could you explain that further Jim?
Jane_Blant: so if we go to inline, we don't see the comments?
Jim_Levin: Well, if you pick "inline", you'll see the paper, and a button after each text unit. If you click the button...
Jim_Levin: you can see who made comments and look at any of them.
Jim_Levin: While with "inline", all the comments are there with the paper.
Jim_Levin: Oops, with "linked" you see the buttons, etc. Sorry about that!
Deena_Sime: Have to run!! Papers to grade!! See ya everyone!!!
Jim_Levin: CU Deena.
Jane_Blant: Bye Deena
Nelda_Bake: bye
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Jim_Levin: There's also a "none" choice, which shows just the paper, with no buttons or comments.
Jim_Levin: The idea is the the "linked" view makes the paper primary, with the comments "hidden" away in the button.
Jim_Levin: Give the various views a try - a comment you make in one view shows up in the others, so they really are just...
Jane_Blant: so they're not distracting.....l
Jim_Levin: different views of the same paper.
Jane_Blant: Off to re-read Bruce and Levin papers! see ya all
Jim_Levin: CU Jane - enjoy!
Nelda_Bake: That sounds exciting, Jane
Debi: Bye Jane
Jane_Blant: You all made me smile!
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Jim_Levin: A little humor goes a long way :-)
Nelda_Bake: It's great, isn't it?
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Brian_Engl: I need to run..Have a great evening everyone.
Nelda_Bake: You mentioned those logs, that'
Jim_Levin: Sometimes it is tricky, though. Sarcasm is dangerous, since people often miss the humor point in this kind of medium.
Debi: Bye Brian
Jim_Levin: by brian.
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Nelda_Bake: Gotta go. See everyone later.
Jim_Levin: cu later Nelda
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Debi: Jim, why does my name appear twice as a login?
Jim_Levin: I'm not sure - did you enter the chat room twice by any chance?
Debi: I tried to enter the chat room, but it said I was already logged in and had to change my name.
Jim_Levin: Yes, that accounts for the Debi. Did youtry to get into chat before that and have a problem?
Debi: Yes
Jim_Levin: So you got in, but didn't think you did, and tried to enter a second time?
Debi: It said Debra_Brennan was already logged in. That's happened to me before, therefore, I keep having to try different names.
Jim_Levin: Hmm, you may be "permanently" logged into this room. Let me see if i can disconnect the "Debra" one.
*** Debra_Brennan has been kicked off channel #Office-hours by Jim_Levin (Jim_Levin)
Debi: Oh that hurt :)
Jim_Levin: Okay, now leave the chat room (sorry about that) and see if you can reenter as Debra
Debi: Ok
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Jim_Levin: Well, now youre Deb.
Jim_Levin: Any problems getting back in?
Deb: Hi JIm. It says Debra_Brennan nickname is already in use as soon as my screen appears.
Jim_Levin: That's strange, since we don't see you as a user.
Jim_Levin: Well, hopefully the next time you try, there won't be a problem. Let me know if there is...
Deb: That's what's been coming up since the first chat room visit. I'm running out of names.
Jim_Levin: so we can track it down.
Jim_Levin: Each time you have to invent a new name?
Deb: Thanks Jim. I'll try again on Thursday's chat.
Jim_Levin: How are you getting into the chat room?
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Deb: Yes. That's whay it's Deb sometimes, Debi other times.
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Jim_Levin: Are you clicking on the "chat" button at the top of webboard's screen?
Deb: I'm going in thought the CTER page and linking to webboard.
Deb: Yes
Jim_Levin: Then clicking on Office-hours.
Jim_Levin: ?
Deb: Ok
Jim_Levin: When do you get the error message that your name is already taken?
Deb: When the screen opens up to office hours chat.
Jim_Levin: Hmm, okay let me check further, and let me know if this happens again on Thursday.
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Jim_Levin: Hi Kim.
Kim_Klein: Bye all!
*** Signoff: Kim_Klein (QUIT: )
Jim_Levin: bye kim
Deb: Thanks Jim. Have a good evening. I'm still trying to locate the information on the Palm pilots and their applications, etc. I'll post it in resources as soon as I get it.
Jim_Levin: great, I'll look forward to that.
Deb: Thanks Jim. Bye.
Jim_Levin: bye Deb/Debi/Debra
Jim_Levin: :-)
Deb: :)
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*** Channel created at Monday, September 18, 2000 12:20:20 PM
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Jill_McCue: Hi Kim, looks like we're early
Kim_Klein: Hi there!
Jim_Levin: Hi Jill & Kim,
Kim_Klein: Hi Jim
Jim_Levin: How's it going?
Kim_Klein: okay, I think I'm stuck on the major project!
Jim_Levin: How so?
Jill_McCue: Hi Jim, I'm really doing the tech thing this week Jamie McKenzie is speaking here tomorrow
Kim_Klein: Well, I thought I would implement a homepage for my classroom. This would act as a newsletter...
Kim_Klein: an additional resource for parents
Jill_McCue: I feel like my project ideas may be too major for the time frame of our class
Kim_Klein: is it okay to do this if all parents don't have access to the web?
Kim_Klein: I would still like to do this idea
Kim_Klein: How do I prove if my goals are met?
Jim_Levin: I don't see a problem, Kim. As far an evaluating goals, what are they?
Kim_Klein: My main goal is to give parents an additional resource to find out about our classroom.
Jim_Levin: So you could ask parents whether they found it a resource, for instance.
Kim_Klein: yes, I guess I could put out a survey or something of that nature
Jim_Levin: What are your project ideas, Jill?
Kim_Klein: I almost forgot...I just got the postition of technology facilitator for my grade level!
Jim_Levin: Hey, congratulation!
Jim_Levin: That's great! (right?)
Jill_McCue: I only have one section of each class per day so I'm wrestling with which class to involve although I'm thinking about English
Kim_Klein: yes, I'm excited about it! It will be great to apply what I'm learning here!
Jill_McCue: Congrats, Kim
Kim_Klein: thank you!
Jim_Levin: Jill, you certainly don't have to involve all your students in the project.
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Jim_Levin: Yes, Kim, a survey/questionaire would be a good approach.
Jill_McCue: I'd like to do something with communication and my ceaf students toencourage and improve theri wrinting
Jim_Levin: Good.
Jill_McCue: Wow look at my typing I need to take my own class
Jim_Levin: Hey, I understood, so it was good enuf.
Jim_Levin: What do they have the most problems with?
Jill_McCue: Topic of tom speech is Forming the Info Literate School Community and Scoring High withthe New Technologies
Jim_Levin: Okay, scoring high on what?
Jim_Levin: I like the literate school community concept.
Jill_McCue: Writing is so taxing to many deaf because of sentence structure and spelling, etc. So they avoid writing and reading and as we all know the only way to gebetter is to do it
Jim_Levin: What kind of community would you/they be interested in participating in?
Jill_McCue: I've tried having the students saving writings to their system files and going in and editing them so they cansee the changes
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Jim_Levin: What about some sort of online newpaper/journal?
Jim_Levin: Hi again Kim.
Jill_McCue: I may see about a pen pal writing situation through a "hearing" class in my building
Kim_Klein: Hi there, I just went to post my proposal in webboard
Jill_McCue: I alos am excited to be able to show parents work on the computer files this year as a small portfolio
Jim_Levin: Okay, I'll look at it later. Jill, what about having them jointly create a web site on some interesting topic?'
Kim_Klein: okay, I think I'm going to go! Thanks for the advice Jim!
Kim_Klein: take care jill!
Jim_Levin: CU later Kim.
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Jill_McCue: That sounds like fun. It would be neat if we could incorporate deaf culture ideas
Jim_Levin: What topic would your deaf students find really interesting?
Jim_Levin: How about an online newsletter for deaf students all over?
Jill_McCue: That varies of course, and deaf culture would not be their pick
Jill_McCue: Maybe a newspaper format would work so that each could be a reporter intheir area of interest.
Jim_Levin: Yes, electronic newspapers work well, especially if they solicit articles from other students, and work on editing.
Jill_McCue: proofreading and revising are much needed skills
Jill_McCue: Maybe a hearing class would be interested in joining us on certain articles
Jim_Levin: Margaret Riel and I did an online newspaper / news wire called Computer Chronicles about 15 years ago that worked well.
Jill_McCue: Would it be set up like aweb page
Jim_Levin: Kids in lots of locations wrote articles, submitted them to a common pool of articles.
Jim_Levin: Then each site choose and edited articles for their own local electronic newspapers.
Jim_Levin: Doing it on the web would be a LOT easier than it was for us back in 1985 :-)
Jill_McCue: I'll have to check the district's server issues
Jim_Levin: You can also use your LRS server space.
Jim_Levin: whichever works for you and your students.
Jill_McCue: We have bess filter on computers and I'll check to see what we can get to for space
Jim_Levin: bess?
Jill_McCue: I'm intrigued with the idea and I'll look into it. Bess is the name of our filter to the web
Jill_McCue: Students can
Jill_McCue: students can't get through it without teacher access codes
Jim_Levin: okay, let me know how it goes, and how we can help.
Jill_McCue: Talk to you later. Looking forward to next Mon chat Bye
Jim_Levin: okay, great, bye.
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Jim_Levin: Hi Deb.
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Jim_Levin: Hi Deb.
Deb: Hi Jim!
Jim_Levin: Looks like you had to enter the chat space twice again?
Jim_Levin: Did you create a new identity for yourself in Webboard?
Deb: Yes. It said that my nickname is already in use. I spoke with Pedro on Fri and he was able to get in from the U. His thoughts were that I am having consistent problems with AOL.
Deb: I tried to create a new login, but it said I was denied access.
Jim_Levin: Yes, people have reported problems using AOL.
Jim_Levin: Denied access? that's strange.
Deb: I'm trying to be pateient until AT&T is in my area. I was told another week or two,but it is so frustrating.
Jim_Levin: Did you go to "more", then "login again", then click on the "new user" button?
Deb: No. I'll try that.
Jim_Levin: okay, let me know if that helps. What else is happening?
Jim_Levin: Anything new with the Palm IIIs?
Deb: Pretty busy. Working on school improvement plans and a middle school tour next week has been keeping me busy.
Jim_Levin: You're hosting a tour or going on a tour?
Deb: Actually, my daughter brought her's home today, funny you asked. Of course, as you said, I can't get near it - but she does have to sleep sometime...
Jim_Levin: You may have to pry it out of her sleeping fingers.
Jim_Levin: Is she a startrek fan? You can win a lot of points if so by downloading and putting onto the Palm the application "Tricorder"
Deb: Our school is part of a tour for the AIMS Conference on Wednesday. So beinga host school is finialize some prep work as far as information sharing, etc. I'm also updating our school web site. So it's been crazy.
Jim_Levin: Lots of visitors?
Deb: She's not really a StarTrek fan - but you never know. I'll have to share that with her. I think her main connections will be in Chem and Eng for initial use.
Jim_Levin: There's a neat little spreadsheet program that's free or shareware for the Palm that I just saw.
Deb: We don't anticipate great crowds. We are in a building for the last year. Our new middle school is currently being built. We won't now the numbers until they arrive though.
Jim_Levin: Do you remember the original IBM PC? The processor in the Palm is the same as was in that desk top computer.
Deb: I haven't had a minute to look at the site you suggested - just cam in from school, but plan on looking at it tonight.
Jim_Levin: The third site (the "newbie" one) is kind of nice, especially if you're just starting out.
Deb: Isn't that just amazing? I remember back in 1972, freshman in college, when my first introduction to computers was a cardboard that moved up and down. Ever see that?
Jim_Levin: Never saw that. My daughter was amazed and skeptical when I showed her my slide rule from high school many moons ago :-)
Jim_Levin: She couldn't believe that it could do computations.
Deb: I try to forget those days :) Moved on to better thing I say.
Deb: I still have one of those slide rules around here too.
Jim_Levin: onward and upward...pretty soon we'll have computers embedded (functional body piercing, eh)
Deb: I don't go for that body piercing too much. They'll have to find another way.
Jim_Levin: I certainly draw the line at tongue piercing and belly button piercing. I can't imagine eating with something stuck through my tongue.
Deb: I agree.
Deb: So are Thursday night chats off or still on?
Jim_Levin: But soon computers will be small enough that you'll be able to have them built into your glasses or a hair decoration.
Deb: That aspect I could live with.
Jim_Levin: A couple sayid they wanted Thursdays, so we'll continue at least another week (I'll draw the line when nobody shows up for the whole hour).
Deb: That sounds logical.
Jim_Levin: Pretty lively discussion about the 2020 visions!
Deb: You know Jim, after reading reactions to the 2020 visions and the Bruce and Levin papers, it's very hard not to think about them in all aspects of daily work. I find myself talking about varied application to teachers and finding new meaning relating standards and projects with students. If the purpose was to instill thought about our practical use. I did the trick.
Jim_Levin: That's certainly a major goal.
Deb: Supposed to be - It did the trick.
Jim_Levin: We've found that this kind of learning works best when you folks can relate what you learn to your own work settings.
Deb: That definitely makes sense. It's just like making connections for students.
Jim_Levin: Please let me know if there are ways to improve that (or if some assignments are lacking in that way).
Deb: For me, at first, it seemed like somewhat of an overload. I had some minor problems adjusting to the format and some of the tech applications and needed to get through that before I could process the deeper work.
Jim_Levin: Soon the tech stuff will be second nature (hope!)
Deb: I believe so too.
Jim_Levin: Okay, let me know if creating a new identity solves these strange WebBoard problems you've been having.
Jim_Levin: It could be that somehow WebBoard's database of people got messed up and is confused as far as your current login is concerned.
Deb: I'm just wondering who I want to be...?????
Jim_Levin: An identity moment!
Jim_Levin: You can still be Debra_Brennan, you just need a new login (though you could be Deb, or Debi, or ???
Deb: When speaking (live) to Pedro, he couldn't understand it either. He was success at the U end, but my attempts seemed to fail. He gave me a new web address and I was able to get in without a problem to webboard, but not in the chat.
Deb: I'll try my original name (again).
Jim_Levin: Okay, that's fine. Just create a brand new login.
Deb: ok
Jim_Levin: Any other issues or questions?
Deb: Thanks for your help on that Jim.
Jim_Levin: sure, hope that helps. CU later.
Deb: CU later. Bye.
Jim_Levin:
Hi Nelda.
Nelda_Bake:
Hi, Jim.
Jim_Levin:
How's it going?
Nelda_Bake:
Did you ever find out about web pages for kids?
Nelda_Bake:
Web page templates, that is,
***
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Muffy_Pacey (jpacey@tnt14c-46.focal-chi.corecomm.net) has joined
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Muffy_Pace:
Hi Jim and Nelda
Nelda_Bake:
I was just made the "technology committee " for my school.
If I have my students make web pages, do I need parent
permission and what safety measures do I need to take?
Nelda_Bake:
Hi, Muffy. I think we
lost Jim!
Muffy_Pace:
Okay
Nelda_Bake:
What are you doing for your project, Muffy?
Muffy_Pace:
Does your school have an Acceptable use Policy for Internet?
Muffy_Pace:
I have no clue yet!
Nelda_Bake:
Not that I know of but that will be something I need to check on.
Muffy_Pace:
If you do, I'd look and see what the policy includes. It might
already cover creating pages
Nelda_Bake:
Do most schools have an Acceptable use Policy for the Internet?
Muffy_Pace:
Yes! It's a huge liability if parents don't want their kiddos on the
net.
Nelda_Bake:
I will contact our tech person and see what she says. We must have something.
Muffy_Pace:
Our school policy covers kids using the net, can their work, photos,
etc. be put on our site
Muffy_Pace:
What are you doing for your project?
Muffy_Pace:
I don't even know where to start.
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Muffy_Pace:
Hi Jim
Nelda_Bake:
Right now, my principal wants me to do a school newspaper on
highwired.com and I want to connect it to my students web pages but
that will depend on our policy, I guess.
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Muffy_Pace:
I'm sure you'll be able to work something out. That sounds neat
Nelda_Bake:
Jim, Are you coming or going/
Ai_Kotake:
Hi...!
Muffy_Pace:
Hi
Jim_Levin:
Sorry folks. Got kicked
out by my computer.
Jim_Levin:
I'm baccccck...
Muffy_Pace:
I've been having problems tonight too
Nelda_Bake:
Has anyone ever worked with Highwired.com?
Ai_Kotake:
Slow connection?
Muffy_Pace:
No
Jim_Levin:
Nelda, you had a question when I disappeared?
Jim_Levin:
What's highwired.com?
Ai_Kotake:
I've never heard of that either..
Muffy_Pace:
Jim, I'm at a loss for what to do for my project. Any suggestions?
Nelda_Bake:
That was some time ago. Let's
see. Muffy and I
were discussing acceptable use policies. I need to find out if we have one before I decide
on my project. Yes?
***
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channel #office-hours
Muffy_Pace:
Hi Jane
Jim_Levin:
Knowing about your districts AUP would be useful.
Ai_Kotake:
I have questions about the project also.
Jim_Levin:
Hi Jane.
Jane_Blant:
Hi everyone
Jim_Levin:
Muffy, I'm going to put up more details about the major project this
weekend.
Nelda_Bake:
Highwired.com is an internet site for school newsletters, mostly mid
and high schools with some elementary schools.
Muffy_Pace:
Great! I don't even really know where to start.
Jim_Levin:
So don't worry (be happy).
***
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Muffy_Pace:
Okay
***
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Jim_Levin:
So you're looking for ways to do an electronic newsletter, Nelda?
Jane_Blant:
That sounds neat
Muffy_Pace:
Jim, did you ever decide if you were going to cancel the Thursday
chat time?
Jim_Levin:
As long as people keep showing up, I'll be here.
Jim_Levin:
If I go a whole hour on Thursday without anyone coming, I'll send a
note canceling it.
Jim_Levin:
Hi Ai. You're on.
Nelda_Bake:
Jim, I was asking you if you knew any more about programs for
children to make web pages, too.
My principal is the one who recommended highwired.com.
Apparently she has used it before.
Yes, I plan on doing an electronic newsletter.
Jim_Levin:
Jane, Muffy, Nelda, Ai in in my oncampus section.
Jane_Blant:
Next Monday is the chat with Margaret from 7 to 8, right?
Ai_Kotake:
HI everyone!
***
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Jane_Blant:
HI Ai
***
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Jim_Levin:
Yes, 7 to 8 CDT (Nelda's in MDT)
***
Tiger_Swan is now known as tige
Jim_Levin:
Hi Tiger.
tige: Hello
Nelda_Bake:
Hi, Ai, Jame
Ai_Kotake:
I have questions about the project also.
tige: I see we are a bit busier tonight
Jim_Levin:
Yes, Jane and Nelda are in the online section; you and Ai in the
oncampus.
Jim_Levin:
What's your question, Ai?
Nelda_Bake:
Jim, Thanks for the reminder about MDT.
Ai_Kotake:
What kind of things are you looking for?
I don't even know where to start with my project...
Jim_Levin:
Nelda, there are lots of templates and web site wizards out there.
Haven't tried them yet.
Jim_Levin:
One suggestion is to look at other projects done for this class in
the past.
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Jim_Levin:
Also, I'm finishing up a "Major Project Proposal Prompter" which
should be ready this weekend.
Ai_Kotake:
Are you wanting a web page design of some sort?
Muffy_Pace:
Sorry, I got kicked off...
Jim_Levin:
Muffy, that happened to me also.
Do you have call waiting?
Jane_Blant:
How did that happen? I
Muffy_Pace:
It's happened 3-4 times tonight, if it happens again, I'll probably
give up for the night
Nelda_Bake:
Muffy, That seems to be going around tonight.
Jim_Levin:
Ai, many projects in the past (especially the oncampus ones) have
involved creating a web site.
Muffy_Pace:
I do, but I have it set on *70
Jim_Levin:
But some have done other things.
Ai_Kotake:
What kind of other things?
Jim_Levin:
Hmm, have you been getting kicked off a lot Muffy?
Muffy_Pace:
Yes, you sent me some modem things earlier this month and I made
those changes too
Jim_Levin:
Ai, some have taken existing software/hardware and tried out a new
education application.
Jim_Levin:
Muffy, did those settings help?
Jane_Blant:
I finally invested in a second line......my son was always on the
computer and we couldn't use the phone!
Muffy_Pace:
Some days I have no problems, other days are really bad.
Nelda_Bake:
Would setting up a program to teach your students word processing
skills be useful as a project?
Jim_Levin:
Muffy, you may want to complain to your phone company.
Jim_Levin:
A second line helps, Jane, but then we found our daughter both on the
phone and the comuter at the same time.
Ai_Kotake:
Does what kind of education use matter?
Muffy_Pace:
I'm moving in two weeks so hopefully a fresh start will take care of
the problem
Nelda_Bake:
Jane, we had to do the same thing only because my husband was always
on-line. I
Jim_Levin:
Ai, you can pick any area of education you want - pick something
you're really interested in.
Ai_Kotake:
Ok.
Jim_Levin:
Where are you moving, Muffy?
Nelda_Bake:
Jim, I'll have to be honest, I talk on the phone and use the computer
at the same time.
Muffy_Pace:
I live in Chicago and I'm just moving about a mile away. Close to
Wrigley Field
Jim_Levin:
Yes, there are advantages to that, Nelda.
Ai_Kotake:
So the major project proposal is due in 2 weeks??
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Jim_Levin:
Going to have any Sosa
homerun balls coming through your windows, Muffy?
Nelda_Bake:
Hi Josh.
Muffy_Pace:
Not that close
Jim_Levin:
Ai, I'll have to check, that sounds right.
Jim_Levin:
Hi Josh.
Josh_Norma:
hi everyone
Muffy_Pace:
Hi Josh
Ai_Kotake:
Muffy, my friend lived literally lived across the street from Wrigley
last year!
Jane_Blant:
Jim, I'm really
interested in elementary reading and would like to do something to
help teachers integrate reading and technology.....does that sound
like it could work?
Jim_Levin:
That sounds great, Jane.
Nelda_Bake:
I'll be interested to see what you come up with, Jane.
Jane_Blant:
O.K. I'll start thinking more.....I work with several elementary
buildings this year and would love to help some of them out....
Josh_Norma:
Jim, I was wondering if you had any other info about the MBARI
article
Jim_Levin:
One strategy is to identify some problem you and your students
currently have.
Jim_Levin:
then look for a technology that might help with that.
Jim_Levin:
What other info, Josh?
Nelda_Bake:
I am looking for something to use with my advanced math students in
4th grade. Does anyone
have any suggestions?
Jim_Levin:
Margaret Riel has other such scenerios you might be intereted in
looking at.
Jim_Levin:
(and of course she'll be available right here Monday night at 7 CDT
Josh_Norma:
I shared the article with my science teacher on my team and he wanted
to try a virtual reality program like that one
Jim_Levin:
Nelda, have you looked at Geometer's Sketchpad.
Jim_Levin:
Well, Josh, that's only a vision right now (the teleprescence part).
There are good simulations.
Nelda_Bake:
No, but I will check it out, Jim.
Is that a software program?
Jim_Levin:
Like simearth, etc.
Jim_Levin:
Nelda, yes, a very nice program that is sort like a word processor
for geoemetry.
Josh_Norma:
That what I thought but I told him that I would ask
Jim_Levin:
oops geometry
Jim_Levin:
There are some new beginning steps toward teleprescence, like
BugScope here at UIUC.
Nelda_Bake:
ok
Jim_Levin:
That allows learners to control a scanning electron microscope
through a web page.
Josh_Norma:
Can anyone use the page
Jim_Levin:
There are also several telescopes available through the web - I think
Margaret links to a page that links to several of those.
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Ai_Kotake:
I must get going now! Thanks
for your help on some project ideas!
Bye everyone!
Jim_Levin:
Right now its an experimental program (they just got a big grant).
Jim_Levin:
CU later Ai. Welcome
Stephen.
Josh_Norma:
hi Stephen
Nelda_Bake:
Hi Stephen.
tige: Hey Jim, I was wanting to ask a question regarding
linking your pages to other pages on the internet. Is there any sort
of etiquette you must do before making a linke? Such as ask
permission to creat the link
Muffy_Pace:
Hi Stephen
Stephen_Ho:
Stephen Hofmann, testing, chat webboard
***
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tige: or can/do you just do it?
Jim_Levin:
There's some controvery about that, Tiger, but generally you don't
have to ask.
Stephen_Ho:
I'm ready for Monday I guess
Jim_Levin:
The controvery comes when you link in a way that makes the linked
site appear to be you own.
Jim_Levin:
Great to hear, Stephen.
tige: I was asking because a friend of mine told me he got a
response from someone whom he created a link to and they asked him
not to do that because it increased the bandwidth
Jim_Levin:
For example, tiger, if you have a framed page, and link to a site
that comes into a frame.
Stephen_Ho:
Jim -- thank you for getting me back on webboard
Josh_Norma:
I really enjoyed the MBARI article Jim and would love to see an
actual site
Jim_Levin:
Glad to see you got on, Stephen.
***
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Josh_Norma:
hi Tim
Muffy_Pace:
Hi Tim
Nelda_Bake:
Hi, Tim.
Jim_Levin:
You might want to look at the Chickscope site, Josh.
Remote control of an MRI.
Stephen_Ho:
signing off everybody. goodnight
Tim_Rogers:
Hi all
Jim_Levin:
Goodnight Stephen.
Jim_Levin:
Welcome Tim.
tige: hello stephan
Tim_Rogers:
Hi Jim
***
Signoff: Stephen_Hofmann (QUIT: )
Jim_Levin:
Stephen is also an on-campus student.
Nelda_Bake:
It seems like it would be a good idea to get parent permission before
putting anything about students on the web, even a newsletter.
Muffy_Pace:
It wouldn't hurt
Jim_Levin:
Good point, Nelda, but that's separate from the linking question.
Josh_Norma:
well hait to run but I got to pack.
I am going white water Kayaking this weekend in Wis.
Jim_Levin:
That's probably part of your district's AUP.
Jane_Blant:
Any more you need their signature for everything
Jim_Levin:
SOunds like fun, Josh.
Muffy_Pace:
What river?
Muffy_Pace:
The Wolf?
Josh_Norma:
yes, the WOlf River
Muffy_Pace:
I've been rafting there, it's a blast!
tige: I think what I have decided with regards to my question
today about the publisher... I think I am going to just take several
basic concepts from that book, and create new scenarios on my own
using the smae principlles
Jim_Levin:
Sandy and I and our daughter Tera are going down the Grand Canyon
next summer.
Jane_Blant:
Have fun!
Josh_Norma:
Yeah, I am excitied. It
is my first discent
Nelda_Bake:
Rafting is great fun. Have
a wonderful time1
Jim_Levin:
Probably the best way to go, Tiger.
Muffy_Pace:
Have fun!
tige: wow! that sounds fun!
i have been on the Wolf before and it was great!
Jim_Levin:
Don't get caught in too many holes.
Josh_Norma:
Everyone have a great weekend. Talk to
you on Monday
tige: There is a teacher who taught at I.C.C. who moved up
there
tige: and probably canoes on the Wolf every day... he loved it
Muffy_Pace:
I'm going to sign off as well. Jim, when can I expect more info. on
the projects? and where will I find it?
Jane_Blant:
I'm off for the night, too ....talk to you all on Monday night!
***
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Jim_Levin:
CU Jane. I'll send email when I get it online, Muffy.
Jim_Levin:
CU Muffy.
Muffy_Pace:
Thank you! Talk to you all on Monday.
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tige: Yeah, it will be a lot of work, but at least I won't
have to worry about messing around with getting the Publisher's ok
Jim_Levin:
Did I get to all your questions, Nelda?
Jim_Levin:
Yes, and you may come up with some
new approaches as well, Tiger.
Jim_Levin:
How's it going, Tim?
Tim_Rogers:
I'v been busy this week
Jim_Levin:
Busy with interesting things I hope?
Nelda_Bake:
Jim, I think you answered all of them, for now. There seems to be no end to the questions.
tige: I hope to with some advice of some of my Japanese
friends, as well as create new scenarios for other cultures.
Will be a great selling tool I hope for a future job
Tim_Rogers:
I have a meeting with the dean tomorrow about the chair person not
wanting me to use technology in the classroon
Jim_Levin:
Well, be sure to ask them, Nelda.
CU later.
Jim_Levin:
Sounds good, Tiger.
Jim_Levin:
What rationale, Tim?
Tim_Rogers:
He thinks all they need is a hammer and a saw
Jim_Levin:
So the world is only nails and wood?
Tim_Rogers:
We had quite a conversation on Friday and it became a little heated
Jim_Levin:
I assume he wasn't interested in things like global competitiveness?
Tim_Rogers:
We all are to sit down a discuss it
Tim_Rogers:
not at all
Tim_Rogers:
he is very narrow minded
Jim_Levin:
Seems hard to imagine - how about your Dean?
Tim_Rogers:
the deans secretary wished me luck today
Jim_Levin:
Is that good or bad?
Tim_Rogers:
we will wait and see
Nelda_Bake:
Jim, you missed my message that said I am now the "Tech Committee"
for my school and the computer lab person now trusts me with the lab.
I have come a long way in just a few weeks.
Jim_Levin:
Best of luck - let us know if we can provide any support (moral or
otherwise)
Tim_Rogers:
I will remind him that he said he would support me in my masters
Jim_Levin:
Hey, that's great Nelda! Congratulations!
Nelda_Bake:
Tim, I don't know why there are always so many hurdles to jump. Good
luck!
Jim_Levin:
You can always blame us for be a subversive influence, TIm.
Tim_Rogers:
I will
Nelda_Bake:
Good luck, all, and good night.
Jim_Levin:
CU later Nelda.
Tim_Rogers:
by nelda
***
Signoff: Nelda_Baker (QUIT: )
Jim_Levin:
Tim, would it help your case if you said that using tech is a
course/program requirement?
Jim_Levin:
or would that just make things worse?
Tim_Rogers:
I'm going to try and be on Monday night ...maybe I can give my
students a library assignment
Jim_Levin:
Maybe you could argue that it would help make your Department/College
a leader?
Jim_Levin:
If you can't make it Monday, we'll have a log of the chat.
tige: that sounds like a good argument
Tim_Rogers:
sounds good
Jim_Levin:
How about if you involve your students in the chat.
Tim_Rogers:
I think so
Tim_Rogers:
That might be a good idea
Jim_Levin:
If you have access to a computer projector, you could participate and
they could watch.
Tim_Rogers:
I can get a data projector I think
Jim_Levin:
Or if you just have a few, they could look over your shoulder.
Tim_Rogers:
I will see what I can do
Jim_Levin:
sounds good. Let us know
how we can help with your meeting.
Tim_Rogers:
they might enjoy it
Tim_Rogers:
thanks
tige: Jim, I found your idea of the office rental quite
interesting. How much
thought have you put into that idea?
Jim_Levin:
Margaret is in California, and we have Nelda from New Mexico,
probably Jason from Florida
Jim_Levin:
and of course all the Illinois folks.
Tim_Rogers:
I'm taking in a copy of the principles letter
tige: It seemed to me like a new business for some
entrepreneur
Jim_Levin:
That might get them interested.
Jim_Levin:
Who signed the letter for you?
Tim_Rogers:
the dean
Jim_Levin:
Sounds like a good thing to do, then.
Jim_Levin:
Some of your students are likely to be using more sophisticated chat
mechanisms already.
Jim_Levin:
(just a warning)
tige: well, I'm going to get onto some reading.
Have a good night
Tim_Rogers:
Well I think I will go to bed and rest up for the big event....Have a
good one and I will try to be on Monday
Jim_Levin:
Okay, CU later Tiger.
***
Signoff: tige (Connection Closed)
Tim_Rogers:
Bye
Jim_Levin:
Hope to see you Monday, Tim. Best
of luck.
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Monday, September 25 (Guest Margaret Riel)
*** Channel created at Monday, September 25, 2000 12:57:01 PM
*** Susan_Holderread (holderrd@c185076-a.afour1.il.home.com) has joined channel #office-hours
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Jim_Levin: Hi Susan.
Jim_Levin: Here early to get a good seat?
Susan_Hold: Hi, Jim. Never done this before. (Was on the mac side at orientation when the chatting was happeining)
Jim_Levin: Its pretty simple - just type in the bottom, and read the scrolling field at the top.
Susan_Hold: I'm curious to see what questions people had for Dr. Riel.
Jim_Levin: But it will get pretty fast and furious when lots of people show up.
*** Jill_McCue (jmccue@c442826-a.mntp1.il.home.com) has joined channel #office-hours
Jim_Levin: I think I got about 10 questions, which I sent her.
Jim_Levin: Hi Jill.
Susan_Hold: Hi Jill
Jill_McCue: Hi all. Is it cold in Central IL?
Susan_Hold: Jill--you're in Chicagoland, aren't you?
Jim_Levin: Its supposed to get down to the high 30's tonight - light frost in some places possible.
Jim_Levin: (I sound like the local weather lady :-)
Susan_Hold: And I just put some mums out!
Jill_McCue: Yes, suburbs are chilly tonight. Kids out but w/ jackets and that won't last long
Susan_Hold: Oh. Soon it'll be getting dark when we get out of school.
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Jim_Levin: Welcome Dan.
Dan_Ryan: Good evening
Susan_Hold: Hi Dan. Don't believe we've met.
Jim_Levin: Dan, Susan is one of the CTER students; Susan, Dan is an oncampus student.
Susan_Hold: Thanks for the intro!
Jim_Levin: (how's that for an online intro?)
*** Margaret_Riel (mriel@cx676004-a.vista1.sdca.home.com) has joined channel #office-hours
Jim_Levin: Hi Margaret, welcome.
Margaret_R: Hi Jim and others
Susan_Hold: Hi there!
Jill_McCue: Hello
Jim_Levin: How's the weather in Sunny So. Cal?
Dan_Ryan: Hello Susan
Margaret_R: Hi Jim, and Susan. and Dan -- it is a lovely day...
Margaret_R: Sun is out shining bright but I am behind a computer all day.
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Jim_Levin: Hi Brian and Muffy.
Brian_Engl: hello everyone
Muffy_Pace: Hi everyone.
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Susan_Hold: Hey, Brian, Muffy.
Jill_McCue: Hi guys, So. CA sounds good
Jim_Levin: It was "dank" here today, but will be very fall-like tomorrow (frost on the pumpkin, etc.)
Margaret_R: :waves to all!
Susan_Hold: Dank?
Jim_Levin: That's what our weather lady said.
Linda_Norm: Hello to all!! Josh and I are here tonight.
Jim_Levin: Welcome Linda & Josh.
Susan_Hold: The family that computes together...
Margaret_R: I guess you can only talk, no emoting?
Jim_Levin: Hi Pei-Szu
Jill_McCue: How should we finish that one Susan?
Jim_Levin: No, that's a TAPPED IN thing.
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Susan_Hold: No idea!
Margaret_R: Oh well
Pei-Szu_Ch: hi all
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Susan_Hold: Hi Kathy. How's Grayslake? or Waukegan?
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Linda_Norm: The family that computes together has only one computer...
Susan_Hold: Aha, Linda!
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Jill_McCue: I like it Linda
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Kathy_Legg: Cold here in Grayslake
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Susan_Hold: Hi Kim.
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Linda_Norm: connection problems
Kim_Klein: Hi there
Jim_Levin: Okay, I guess we're ready to start. I sent Margaret the list of questions that I got, about 10 of them.
Linda_Norm: hi Kim
Susan_Hold: I was going to say...
Margaret_R: Hi everyone
Kim_Klein: Hello
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Linda_Norm: Hello, Margaret
Jim_Levin: Margaret, as you know, is the author of several papers you've read, is a leader in the research, development and practice in this field.
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Jim_Levin: She's ready to answer questions that some of you sent ahead of time, and any you want to ask at this point. Any introductory remarks, Margaret?
Margaret_R: Dan can't make up his mind if he wants to stay
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James_Bert: Dan, always a trouble-maker...
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Margaret_R: Well I guess I just want to let you know that your questions were good ones.
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Margaret_R: Some of them have answers online but others don't
Margaret_R: Do you want to start by posing one of them
Margaret_R: I have thought about responses.
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Jim_Levin: Pick any of them. I see that Jill and Jane are here. Want to take either of theirs?
Jim_Levin: How about Jill's:
Jill_McCue: I'll start because I'm involved in Special Ed. Where do you see multiply disabled students fitting into learning centers if they are not independent workers or able to communicate?
Sang-Deug_: Am I in or not?
Jim_Levin: You're in Sang-Deug
Sang-Deug_: yes
Sang-Deug_: Thank your
Margaret_R: Ok as for the model, I think that special would be mainstreamed for the following reasons
Margaret_R: I thought I could copy in text but that didn't work...I think that there is space for students of all skill levels to participate in the community. Especially if students see it as their role to help be inclusive.
Margaret_R: The main reason is that we need to have a way to teach the skills of inclusion
Margaret_R: to everyone in the society and the school is a good start.
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Jill_McCue: Will we have 1 on 1 aides for nonreaders who could not even log in?
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Jim_Levin: You can copy in one line at a time.
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Margaret_R: Are you talking about the online or the Learning Community idea?
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Jill_McCue: Learning Community but I saw that attendance and work logs were on computer.
Margaret_R: Because in the Learning Community notion there is both online and face to face
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Margaret_R: Yes, and all kids need to be helped to work in a literate society...
Margaret_R: but that means more than text...
Margaret_R: Soon the input to computers will be verbal and also soon all of us ..
Jill_McCue: Definitely
Margaret_R: will be needing new multi-media skills.
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Margaret_R: Did you see the think Quest site where the elementary students. ...
Jill_McCue: I work with deaf students so oral /written language is a challenge to work on
Margaret_R: described what they learned from having a Down's Syndrome child in the class?
Margaret_R: Yes, but technology is working on all aspects of communication.
Margaret_R: I think it would be great if everyone learned sign as a second language...
Margaret_R: but you need to get a critical mass of people to agree <smile>.
Margaret_R: Jane's question is somewhat related as she asked about how a teacher finds resources.
Jill_McCue: I agree that an included society is beneficial but I still wrestle with the skills that schools have taken on like basic hygiene as being part of a learning environment for all
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Margaret_R: Yes, I agree, I would instead like to see the schools take on more effort in the
Margaret_R: area of social relationships.
Margaret_R: I think that it is important for people to learn to give and take from people with a ...
Margaret_R: range of skills and abilities.
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Jim_Levin: Is your notion that some of this "common knowledge" could be learned from peers or from more experienced kids?
Nelda_Bake: It will take much eductation before everyone can accept a true inclusion classroom. I've been working in one for 3 years, now.
Margaret_R: I think that it is learning from working together in supported environments.
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Nelda_Bake: I have seen the benefits to our special education students and think it would be very workable in your learning centers.
Margaret_R: I think that if we start breaking down the notion of grouping students who are the same.
Jim_Levin: The key shift is to recognize that learners can learn from each other as well as from the adults.
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Leonard_Fr: Inclusion will have a definite effect on many High School courses, like Chemistry.
Margaret_R: That we will find, as Jim says, that they can learn from each other and from the ...
Jill_McCue: I'm talking about non language users
Margaret_R: experience of working together on a common project
Nelda_Bake: Some of the greatest teachers in our class are the other students.
Leonard_Fr: If students are able to learn more from each other, they will not have to depend on teachers as much.
Margaret_R: Students are the best untapped educational resource we have.
Nelda_Bake: Working together sometimes traverses an area beyond language.
Margaret_R: I couldn't agree more.
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Leonard_Fr: I think the Board of Education should hire students to teach.
Sang: <smile>
Margaret_R: Well I am not sure about that but I think that if we could get all students to be teachers...
Jill_McCue: Socially there are huge gains by being in our mainstream bldg and the "hearing" kids are nothing but help
Jim_Levin: Great idea, Leonard. At least, there should be some recognition of the important role they can play.
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Margaret_R: that we would have solved the educational problems.
Jim_Levin: What about Jane's question about where to find resources?
Margaret_R: There are so many great places and people who are willing to share their ideas...
Margaret_R: that this is really no longer a problem.
Jim_Levin: where would you suggest starting?
Jane_Blant: the big factor for teachers is time and where the best place to start is...
Margaret_R: I have listed places that support community approaches to learning
Jim_Levin: Which paper or web site?
Margaret_R: But each of the places that I mention lists a dozen more.
Leonard_Fr: We should establish a student teaching certificate; just like a student driving license.
Linda_Norm: I see a problem with coordinating all of this to make sure a well-rounded curriculum is being offered to ALL.
Margaret_R: www.gse.uci.edu/tlc
Jim_Levin: okay, I'll add that to our "Resources" conference.
Margaret_R: But also in the whitepaper I just finished http://www.gse.uci.edu/mriel/whitepaper/
Jane_Blant: I'll check that out
Margaret_R: For every subject there are communities forming...
Jim_Levin: This is the DoEd whitepaper?
Margaret_R: yes, and it is these communities that offer the best help.
Margaret_R: For Math there are the Math Forums,
Margaret_R: for science that are multiple groups.
Tim_Rogers: Margaret, my class is here and they would like to know if you have any insight into where vocational education is going to go.
Margaret_R: for teachers professional development, Tapped In, Teachersnet, Harvard's ENT
Margaret_R: Well I think that there is going to be a blending of vocational with academic.
Margaret_R: Or I should say that is where I hope it goes.
Margaret_R: We need to help students develop a set of new literacy skills that they did not need before.
Margaret_R: Before there was a printing press, mass print literacy does not make sense.
Jim_Levin: What new literacy skills do you foresee?
Leonard_Fr: They certainly should be computer literate
Margaret_R: Not technology literate but information and media literate.
Linda_Norm: How will we evaluate if we are accomplishing the task?
Margaret_R: We will all need to know how to make movies.
Jill_McCue: How does one take a scheduled school day and begin without losing what is dictated to be taught until we can change to learning communities?
Margaret_R: Not just for fun but for our jobs.
Margaret_R: we need to learn how to communicate with images and sounds and motion.
Beth_Tward: Good question Jill.
Margaret_R: Well it turns out you can embed lots of the things you have to teach in projects
Jim_Levin: is the question, how do we get there from here?
Margaret_R: that teach much more.
Margaret_R: That is an important but not limiting question.
Jill_McCue: Yes, it may be a long time in the making
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Margaret_R: It is not difficult at it seems.
Jim_Levin: How do you deal with those that say you can't get the "coverage" if you have projects?
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Margaret_R: When you and I had students writing for newspapers, they learned 4 years worth
Margaret_R: of language mechanics in one year.
Margaret_R: Why?
Margaret_R: Because it takes four years to teach skills out of context.
terry: I agree with the project approach but how does this impact teacher planning time
Jim_Levin: Margaret's referring to work we did about 15 years ago with students writing for an online newspaper.
Margaret_R: If we embeded skills in things that students want to do, then they decide to learn.
Jim_Levin: (hmm, 20 years ago? :-)
Margaret_R: Students often make not learning their response to a boring school environment.
Jenna_Brya: I agree Margaret! My students are loving to write when it is personal and involving things they want to do.
Margaret_R: Well Jim, "some time ago" works...
Jill_McCue: I'm considering a newsletter written by the students, but when do I teach other forms of literature if we are in the comp lab working on the paper
Margaret_R: I continue to have students involved in Learning Circles writing to communicate.
Jim_Levin: How about a literature section of the newspaper?
Jane_Blant: I was just at a standards alignment workshop last week that talked a lot about Stiggins and assessment and that students should help design their own..
Jim_Levin: You could have a poetry column, a book review column, a creative writing section, etc.
Margaret_R: I agree that students should create rubrics. In that same project I did with Jim...
Kathy_Legg: I do a lot of projects and units in my classroom, but lack support from parents who seem to think that the school has all the responsibility for the learning their child does. How do I get the parents engaged, when they don't place much value on education?
Margaret_R: so many years ago the review process was critical. We had students determine if
Margaret_R: a piece of writing should be published. They got very serious as they were judging ..
Margaret_R: the work of other students from other classrooms. The rubrics they formed were..
Margaret_R: very effective in improving their own writing.
Margaret_R: Now parents...
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Margaret_R: They vary and unfortunately many of them are working way too hard to provide the
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Margaret_R: kind of help that students need.
Margaret_R: And we need to, as a society, deal with this fact.
Margaret_R: It does not help to say parents should be doing this. Ultimately it is the responsibility
Margaret_R: of the citizens to see that they create a way to help all students learn.
Margaret_R: So we need to think about structuring both in and out of school time.
Margaret_R: Technology can help, but it is not enough.
Tim_Rogers: My class would like to know if the use of the pen will be lost in the future with all the computer usage
Margaret_R: Have you diagrammed a year of a child's life?
Margaret_R: It is a great project for students to see how much free time they have. School only
Jill_McCue: The online VIP program made me curious about the confines of a school day as far as time. Students working w/ international teams are going to have some unusual time frames
Margaret_R: takes up about 14% of the year.
Linda_Norm: How will we accomodate schools that are poverty stricken and can't afford technology.
Kathy_Legg: The only place most of my students see technology is in school.
Margaret_R: It is hard now that technology is still relatively expensive but it will change.
Margaret_R: Now for the pencil, I don't think it is any more risk of disappearing than radio is.
Margaret_R: We add technologies and then we make decisions about when serves what functions.
Margaret_R: This is a very different task...type talking.
Margaret_R: It is slow for me and slow for you.
Linda_Norm: Will the students dealing with the lack of parental support and poverty will need more structure than the learning communities can give?
Margaret_R: What are other choices and what do they bring or lose. Let me finish this and I will answer Linda..
Margaret_R: Soon we will be able to move very flexibly between voice and text so that we can
Margaret_R: decided when to use either.
Kathy_Legg: In the low income situations, will the learning communities become living communities, having the learning communities serving as surrogate parents?
Margaret_R: Ok, the reasons for the community/assessment teachers in this plan...
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Margaret_R: is that everyone needs good academic counseling as they go through school.
Margaret_R: And some parents are very good at giving it.
Margaret_R: Others are not.
Margaret_R: By having a teacher follow the same students for 3 years, there is an attempt to build up
Margaret_R: a relationship ... an understanding that will help students feel that someone cares if they succeed.
James_Bert: Margaret, you said that it is ultimately the responsibility of citizens to create a way to help all students to learn. What will be the impetus to move them in the direction of Learning Centers and away from schools?
Margaret_R: I see schools becoming learning centers.
Margaret_R: I don't see us abandoning schools but rather transforming them.
James_Bert: Would you say that by 2020, they are more of a prediction or an aspiration?
Margaret_R: Have you see the Epcot Center in Florida? That is the best existing place that models
Margaret_R: what schools should look like.
Jim_Levin: So we should take a field trip to Orlando!
Margaret_R: 2020 is a very long way away. I think that we are on course for the
terry: do you see the virual hs movement as a move toward learning communities or trying to maintain the traditional school virtually?
Margaret_R: changes that I described for 2005
Margaret_R: I see them as both...but I think that it will help to introduce more choice and help...
Margaret_R: students take more control of the process.
Margaret_R: I think that control to the learner is crucial.
Linda_Norm: I agree totally!!
Jill_McCue: Will we start at the elem level and work up or work down with the students who are first to enter the job world
Margaret_R: I realize that students do not always know what they want to learn.
Jim_Levin: They certainly will put some more pressure on existing schools, since students will have a plausible alternative (at least in some cases).
Margaret_R: At a Thinkquest conference, one of the speakers listed all of the inventions in technology that
Margaret_R: were created by students, either still in school or students who dropped out of school,
Margaret_R: the list was impressive.
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Jim_Levin: Yes, many of the Internet technologies were invented by university students.
Margaret_R: The kids of today realize that the adult population is taking them seriously.
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Margaret_R: I think we need and will have more of what is sometimes called service learning
Margaret_R: or learning in the service of the community.
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Jim_Levin: We have about 10 minutes left. Are there questions folks haven't asked yet that you'd like to ask?
Margaret_R: There are so many problems that kids can solve working together.
Jim_Levin: More connections between learning and doing?
Jim_Levin: Olga, who couldn't be here asked me to ask: 1. What will be the major differences, if any, between today on-line adult learners and future on-line adult learners, for example, 5 years and 10 years from now?
Margaret_R: Why don't we use the time for some of you to tell me what you are doing with technology
Margaret_R: that excites you.
Dan_Ryan: Margaret - you mentioned earlier that movies needed to be made...
Jill_McCue: Is there research on online learning and truly doing like I would be scared to death to go in a submersible but I think I could watch it on a monitor or flat wall
Jim_Levin: There are already some very exciting proposals for major projects by these folks :-)
Margaret_R: I will send you short answers to the questions that students asked ahead of time.
Dan_Ryan: what do you mean by this?
Margaret_R: Dan I am not sure what the this refers to ... I will try to look back.
Jim_Levin: That's great, Margaret, that you'll answer the submitted questions.
Jim_Levin: Other things people are excited by that you want to bring up?
Dan_Ryan: To be more specific, you said: "we will all need to make movies"
Dan_Ryan: it is a little before halfway through
Margaret_R: Yes, we will, in our everyday jobs...
Margaret_R: be required to communicate ideas in multimedia format
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Jim_Levin: (ackward construction: any thing else you EdPsy 387 folks are excited by?)
Margaret_R: Because we will use multi-media
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Dan_Ryan: Do you think more learning will be visual as opposed to more
Dan_Ryan: traditional forms?
Margaret_R: It will be more visual, more print, more text more sound...
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Margaret_R: We will have options as we have now in communication. We can write, call , fax,
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Margaret_R: send pictures etc.
Margaret_R: But still it is the what we say to each other...as well as how we say it.
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Margaret_R: We need to be able to shape messages to audiences and use the technology to be effective.
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Jim_Levin: What would you think, Margaret, would be the most productive thing for these folks to learn/do to create a better future?
Debra_Bren: Margaret, a question that always arises is accountability. Any thoughts on attending to accountability as our technology manifests in different ways?
Dan_Ryan: It seams as if visual learning is an open area which...
Margaret_R: Spend some part of every day learning... and teaching...
Dan_Ryan: may help to motivate students more.
Jim_Levin: Great answer!
Jim_Levin: That applies to everyone :-)
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Margaret_R: As for assessment the conference was on assessment and there are great resources there.
Jim_Levin: This is the DoEd conference? I'll put the URL to it in our Resources conference.
Jim_Levin: I want to thank Margaret very much for taking the time to talk with us. Clap! Clap! Clap!
Margaret_R: Yes, it is good to explore that website...there is so much really interesting work going on.
Debra_Bren: The resources were very thought provoking. I just wondered if you had any additional thoughts.
Susan_Hold: Thanks for your time.
Jill_McCue: Thanks so much
Jane_Blant: Thanks, Margaret
Margaret_R: Thanks for the invite...
Jenna_Brya: Thank you!:)
Debra_Bren: Thank you Margaret!
Sang: Thanks
Muffy_Pace: Thank you
Deena_Sime: Thanks!!
Leonard_Fr: Thanks, Margaret
pace: Thanks
Kathy_Legg: Thanks Margaret!!
Marna_Kitz: Thank you!
Dan_Ryan: Thanks
Tiger: Thanks
terry: thank you !!
Tim_Rogers: Tim's class says Thanks
Nelda_Bake: Thank you!
Margaret_R: And I guess my parting message is that you create the present time...
Margaret_R: by what you do every day. You also can shape a different tomorrow by what you do each day.
Beth_Tward: Yes! Clap! Clap!
Linda_Norm: Thank you for this hour. We appreciated the chat time! Linda & Josh
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Jim_Levin: We'll have the chat log ready sometime tomorrow.
Margaret_R: Good luck to all of you!
Jim_Levin: Thanks!
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Margaret_R: to Jim...I hope you will work a bit on my typing... I kept running out of the box.
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Jim_Levin: Sure, I'll fix the spellings, etc.
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Margaret_R: Hard to type fast...I think we need a system of voice to text here....
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Jim_Levin: let us know if we can do anything for you next semester when you're teaching online.
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Margaret_R: I am going to see if I can get some physical exercise for the rest of my body besides my fingers.
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Jim_Levin: Sounds good. Swimming?
Margaret_R: I always am in your debt Jim,
Margaret_R: bye for now.
Jim_Levin: CU later.
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Margaret_R: no but swimming would be nice.
Margaret_R: CU later...
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Linda_Norm: Bye, all!
Jim_Levin: Bye Linda & Josh.
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Jane_Blant: Hi Jim
Jim_Levin: Hi Jane.
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Jim_Levin: Hi Nelda.
Nelda_Bake: Hi, Jim.
Jane_Blant: I had a neat opportunity yesteday....I got to hear Michael Fullan speak!
Jane_Blant: Hi, Nelda
Nelda_Bake: Hi, Jane.
Jim_Levin: What did he talk about?
Jane_Blant: Have you ever heard him or read his books, Jim? He talks about change and how difficult it is ...
Jane_Blant: He's from Ontario
Jim_Levin: He's the head of OISE. haven't heard him speak.
Jim_Levin: Ontario Institute for Studies in Education
Jane_Blant: The ILP and state board brought him to Mt.vernon for a daylong conference.
Jim_Levin: Neat, did he say anything about technology?
Jane_Blant: He talks a lot about collaborative culture and shared leadership in schools
Jane_Blant: He really didn't mention technology.....there were lots of principals, superintendents, a few board members...he talked mostly about the change in the structure of schools
Jim_Levin: That's certainly important, both with and independent of technology.
Jim_Levin: Did he talk about change at all?
Jane_Blant: he talked about the resistance to change which fits in with technology and how some teachers perceive it..
Jim_Levin: How are things going with EdPsy 387 for you folks?
Jane_Blant: I'm still working on my idea for the project
Jim_Levin: Are things developing okay?
Jane_Blant: I'm just not sure which way to go with my reading idea.
Jim_Levin: Which ways are you considering?
Jane_Blant: How are things out west, Nelda?
Nelda_Bake: Now, I have a technology committee on board at my school. We are taking an inventory of the technology in each classroom, what works and what doesn't work, etc. Then, we will develop a technology plan for our school. I am trying to narrow down my project. There are so many things I want to do that I feel I should pick one and the attempt the rest.
Jane_Blant: I was wondering about what I could do that would help some of the elem. schools I go into
Jim_Levin: Sounds like its keeping you real busy Nelda. Yes, the key is to focus.
Jim_Levin: What are the biggest problems they have, Jane?
Nelda_Bake: Jane, Maybe you could survey your schools and find out what they have available and what there concerns are.
Jane_Blant: really concrete ways to integrate it into lessons
Jane_Blant: that's a good idea, Nelda
Jim_Levin: Yes, if you can identify ore or more concerns the teachers have, and then find a technology that might help, that's a good start.
Jane_Blant: I'm in an elemen. building next week for a review, so I'll poll them
Nelda_Bake: Our problem is that most of the technology available doesn't work. It might be helpful if you develop something like a web quest and implement it for one of the teachers to get them excited.
Jim_Levin: You might ask them what's the biggest problem that they face in teaching reading.
Jane_Blant: thanks, good ideas
Jim_Levin: Yes, Nelda, some uses put a lot fewer demands on the technology, and thus are better starting points.
Nelda_Bake: Especially for people who are resistant and have had bad run-ins with technology.
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Jim_Levin: When I talk to folks about integrating technology (whether higher ed or pre-college), I try to spread out a "smorgesbord" of possibiliites.
Nelda_Bake: Hi, Josh.
Josh_Norma: Hi Everyone
Jim_Levin: Hi Josh.
Jane_Blant: HI Josh
Josh_Norma: How is everyone doing?
Jim_Levin: Jane, that way, each person can pick what they think will fit their own needs.
Nelda_Bake: The only thing about that Jim, is that many teachers need something more concrete.
Jane_Blant: so, possibly come up with a site that offers different technolgical levels or choices for elem. teachers?
Jim_Levin: You can make the "smorgesbord" possibilities pretty concrete.
Jim_Levin: That's a good idea, Jane.
Josh_Norma: JIm, quick question. I was trying to send my tech problems to the site you gave us and it keeps saying server can't be reach
Jim_Levin: Jane's talking about her major project proposal, Josh.
Josh_Norma: or server down
Josh_Norma: I didn
Josh_Norma: typo
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Jim_Levin: How's your geographical themes web idea going, Josh?
Josh_Norma: I was just ging over the rubric that I am going to use to assess it
Jim_Levin: Good to hear!
Josh_Norma: I decided to only do it with one of my classes and not all 110 students
Jim_Levin: Good idea - that will make it quite a bit more manageable.
Josh_Norma: I wanted to give it a trial run and them improve on it
Jim_Levin: That's a good strategy.
Jim_Levin: Nelda, how's your major project proposal going?
Josh_Norma: My only worry is that I have enough time in the computer lab
Jim_Levin: How does that get scheduled, Josh?
Josh_Norma: first come first serve and we have two labs with 25 computers each
Josh_Norma: it still is hard to get
Josh_Norma: teachers are constantly fighting over it
Jim_Levin: Can you form your students into teams, so that each team uses a computer? Also, a lot of work can be done off the computer, to maximize the use of the lab.
Nelda_Bake: I was thinking of narrowing it down to a school newspaper and having a group of 10 students develop web pages which will all be linked, with my other students to follow later in the year. Then it wouldn't be so overwhelming.
Jim_Levin: Good way to start, Nelda.
Josh_Norma: I am doing both but I am still nervous about time
Nelda_Bake: My initial group could then work as mentors for my other students.
Jim_Levin: That's also a good idea. Margaret Riel pointed out that when we did the "Computer Chronicles" the major learning seemed to occur when students were editing.
Jim_Levin: So keep in mind not only the writing, but the editing/rewriting/selecting parts of newspaper creation.
Josh_Norma: I am going to have each group edit another groups page
Jim_Levin: We noticed with that earlier work that students were hesitant to edit each others work, but not so the writing of remote kids.
Josh_Norma: Jim " I am still unable to get my tech problems posted on the site"
Nelda_Bake: I think that would probably be true and I am looking for a challenging activity for my gifted students. Of course, I don't know too much about writing newspaper articles. Guess I'll have to start from the bottom and go from there.
Jim_Levin: What happens when you try?
Josh_Norma: it keeps saying server is down or unable to be reach
Jim_Levin: What happens, Josh, when you try?
Josh_Norma: it been that way for 2 days
Jim_Levin: Hmm, I just checked and the server looks ok. Let me try posting a test trouble.
Josh_Norma: thanks
Josh_Norma: Jane, what is your major project?
Jim_Levin: Josh, try it again while we're on and let me know if its still a problem (and you can add that to your trouble log :-)
Jane_Blant: well....I haven't decided for sure, but since I'm not in the classroom and am out working with schools, I 'd like to do something in the area of elem. reading to help them if I could..
Jim_Levin: Jane, picking up on what we talked about earlier, how about a web resources for elem. reading teachers?
Jane_Blant: that really sounds good to me and I could leave it when I go out
Josh_Norma: Jim it working now, I will have to send the rest of it tomorrow because it is on my computer at school, I pray that it will work again
Jim_Levin: Let me know, Josh, if it doesn't
Jim_Levin: Yes, Jane, you could collect activities, and classify which would be good to start with, and what they're likely to be good for, etc.
Jane_Blant: that sounds great
Josh_Norma: Jim, are you talking about Jane producing a handbook like we had to read
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Josh_Norma: except with activities instead of definitions etc.
Josh_Norma: Jim is gone, what should we do
Jane_Blant: oops we lost him!
Nelda_Bake: Frightening isn't it?
Josh_Norma: is he coming back
Nelda_Bake: It's like when the leader of your spaceship disappears, in flight.
Jane_Blant: He usually says cu later if he's leaving!@###
Josh_Norma: I was just on the server and it said it was down
Jane_Blant: I'm sure he'll be proud if we carry on without him
Jane_Blant: but if the server
Josh_Norma: that was why I ask him why I couldn't send my log
Jane_Blant: is down he might not be back
Nelda_Bake: Jane, I thought maybe Jim was talking about a list of links with grouped according to area of interest.
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Jane_Blant: I was wondering about that.....do you think that would be a good idea for teachers? listing links for them?
Josh_Norma: nice to see you back
Nelda_Bake: I am not sure that teachers are ready or have the time for anything that is too lengthy to read.
Jim_Levin: I don't know what happened, just got kicked out.
Josh_Norma: we were worried that you were lost in space Jim
Jim_Levin: Short is good, Jane.
Jane_Blant: I'll remember short is good....I agree
Josh_Norma: I agree Nelda
Nelda_Bake: I know that I have spent a lot of time searching for things. Maybe you could come up with something to address the needs of each school.
Jim_Levin: Once you get a few collected together in a web page, Jane, let folks know so we can give yoou feedback.
Jane_Blant: ok, thanks for all the help
Nelda_Bake: I'm going to sign off for tonight. Goodnight everyone.
Jim_Levin: CU later, Nelda
Josh_Norma: Bye Nelda have a great weekend
Jane_Blant: Night, Nelda, I think I'll be off too.....have a great weekend everyone
Josh_Norma: Bye jane
Jim_Levin: bye Jane.
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Josh_Norma: Jim You been watching the olympics
Jim_Levin: Josh, let me know when you have a start on your geography page.
Jim_Levin: Not too much Olympics - this has been a busy semester.
Josh_Norma: I am starting this monday
Josh_Norma: I try to get on Monday night and let you know how the first day went.
Jim_Levin: Its important to get feedback all along the way from a variety of folks.
Jim_Levin: Okay, I'll look forward to hearing on Monday night.
Josh_Norma: In the future I am going to use my first students sight as resources for my other students
Josh_Norma: I let you go
Jim_Levin: That's a great idea. It is motivate both the first students and inspire the rest.
Jim_Levin: Okay, have a great weekend.
Josh_Norma: Have a great weekend, I will try to be on Monday but we started basketball practice so I might not be home in time
Jim_Levin: That's okay, you can send email if you don't get on chat.
Josh_Norma: CU
Jim_Levin: nye
Jim_Levin: bye
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Debra_Bren: Hi Jim!
Jim_Levin: How's it going?
Debra_Bren: Things are going well. Busy, but good.
Jim_Levin: Sorry I missed you on Thursday.
Debra_Bren: Sandy ok?
Jim_Levin: She gets her stitches out tomorrow and hopes she'll then be able to put weight on her foot.
Debra_Bren: Not a problem. I logged on after coming in late from a board meeting.
Debra_Bren: That's good. She'll just have to take it a day at a time.
Jim_Levin: She's been pretty much bed/couch/easy chair ridden - good thing she's teaching an online course.
Debra_Bren: That's for sure. It's also nice to be pampered for a while.
Jim_Levin: She wants to know if it will continue after she's recovered.
Debra_Bren: Ha!
Jim_Levin: How's your major project going?
Debra_Bren: I think it's going well. I've worked on some of the templates. I will hopefully be able to get power point and video presentations to be linked.
Jim_Levin: Sounds great! Be sure to try it out on folks, even before you're done.
Jim_Levin: That's called "formative evaluation" :-)
Debra_Bren: I was working on my school web site and no one (including me) knew how to put power point on. They said it was a major task for the new school update. So I guess I have my work cut out for me.
Jim_Levin: In what sense do you want to put powerpoint on?
Jim_Levin: Powerpoint has a "Save as HTML" option. Is that what you want to do?
Debra_Bren: I wanted to have students create power point presentations about their book talks, along with some video tapes. They do power point all the time, so that's not a real issue. I'm not sure how to put that on a web site though.
Debra_Bren: Is that all I need to do?
Jim_Levin: Okay, each can do the "save as html", which will create a bunch of files in a folder. Then you upload the whole folder.
Debra_Bren: Hmmm. Have to try that tomorrow.
Jim_Levin: In that folder will be an "index.htm" file. If you point to that from your other files, that will start things out right.
Debra_Bren: I'm taking notes.
Jim_Levin: You can test this out without uploading. Just take a Powerpoint, do the "save as html", ...
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Jim_Levin: then open the "index.htm" file from your browser to see what it looks like.
Jim_Levin: Hi Nelda.
Nelda_Bake: Hi, Jim.
Jim_Levin: We're talking about how Deb is going to create web-ized powerpoints.
Debra_Bren: That sounds too easy. I was racking my brain. Sometimes all we need to do si ask, right?
Debra_Bren: Hi Nelda.
Jim_Levin: Asking often helps :-)
Debra_Bren: Thanks Jim. I'll try this tomorrow at school.
Jim_Levin: Okay, let me know if there are any problems (after you log them :-)
Debra_Bren: I will. Thanks!
Nelda_Bake: I'm afraid that is way beyond me. I'm having great difficulty trying to find anything on our school computers that will let me make a web page.
Jim_Levin: How are things, Nelda? Do you have Netscape Navigator on the computers?
Nelda_Bake: Hi, Debra,
Jim_Levin: There are many ways to create and edit web files. The major advantage of Netscape Navigator/Composer is that it is free.
Nelda_Bake: Yes, we do have Netscape Nav, but I am having difficulty getting it to function properly. Once they are made in Navigator , do I have to send them elsewhere or could I make links from our school home page and add them on to that.?
Nelda_Bake: Whatever I do, it has to be free!
Jim_Levin: Once you create them (in Netscape or otherwise), you copy them to a server (could be your school server) and then link to them.
Jim_Levin: If it is a problem to put files on your school server, you can put them on any other server (like the LRS) and link to them there.
Debra_Bren: I used Netscape Composer to create our school web site. It's linked to the rest of the district's pages, but was fairly easy to do. Not a lot of bells and whistles on it right now, but a good start. My next task is working with staff for 2 inservice days in Dec to create individual web pages. I thought that would even be a good major project, due to creating a needs assessment, etc. but I am not doing that staff development until after ou
Nelda_Bake: Would it be better to have the classroom websites created in Netscape and then figure out how to put them on the web?
Jim_Levin: Who's creating the classroom websites and who's uploading (could be different answers).
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Jim_Levin: Hi Paulette.
Debra_Bren: Just from my experience, and limites as it is, I had students and staff create the pages and save them in a file. When I'm ready to upload I can then upload quickly.
Debra_Bren: Hi Paulette
Nelda_Bake: I planned on working with the teachers to make a site for their classroom.What do you mean by who is uploading?
Jim_Levin: Yes, having students create and edit web files locally until they're "done" then having someone else (could be a student) upload them all works
Jim_Levin: Oops, having teachers create and edit web files locally ....
Debra_Bren: My district has one person per building right now with "access" to upload. I don't let students do that yet.
Jim_Levin: Nelda, is your web server in your building or elsewhere?
Nelda_Bake: We are connected to a server in Socorro. We don't have one in the school.
Jim_Levin: Okay, that rules out "sneakernet" (putting the files on a disk and walking over to the server and copying them :-)
Nelda_Bake: That sounds a lot easier.
Jim_Levin: But someone (could be you, could be someone else) could at least initially take responsibility for uploading the files.
Jim_Levin: Paulette, how's your project going?
Nelda_Bake: That's fine, but I really don't know where to begin. Should I just get the pages made and then worry about what to do with them. Seems like I should have a plan.
Jim_Levin: One plan would be to develop a "template" class web page (or set of pages).
Jim_Levin: Then try that out with one teacher, and go through the whole process of getting it on the server to be sure everyihing works.
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Kim_Klein: hello
Jim_Levin: Hi Kim.
Debra_Bren: Hi Kim
Nelda_Bake: I would make my own template on a blank page?
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Kim_Klein: Jim,
Kim_Klein: I got your response about putting a new page up on the server
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Jim_Levin: Yes Nelda. Just create what you think would be a good class page (maybe your own class page), then...
Jim_Levin: replace all the specifics with ALL CAPS describing what is to be filled in.
Jim_Levin: Yes Kim?
Jim_Levin: (the ALL CAPS is just my own convention, by the way)
Kim_Klein: So, I design my page, save it, and how do I get the lrs server again?
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Jim_Levin: Kim, you use an "FTP client": Fetch for the Mac; WS_FTP for Windows.
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Kim_Klein: okay, I used ftp to upload everything
Jim_Levin: There are online tutorials on Fetch & WS_FTP plus I think you folks got printouts at Orientation.
Jim_Levin: If you've uploaded it, Kim, then that's it. The new files are "on the web".
Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, I am about half finished with my project. I plan to have it completed and ready for student use by November 1st. Do you need to see the completed project before I do that?
Jim_Levin: No, I don't have to see it, but I'd be glad to take a look if you'd like.
Paulette_W: Hi Kim, I didn't mean to be rude when you said hello earlier!
Kim_Klein: hello paulette
Jim_Levin: If you want, Paulette, put the URL in your progress report that's due about then.
Jim_Levin: Or you can send the URL to your major project to me in email anytime.
Jim_Levin: Kim, you can test whether the new file is on the web by entering the full URL to it in a web browser.
Kim_Klein: I don't know the URL that's the problem
Jim_Levin: If you put a new file, named, say NEW-FILE.HTML into your folder on the LRS folder, the URL would be...
Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, I plan to have the files uploaded to my school server. It would probably be easier for us both if I sent you the Internet address and then email the page through an email attachment. I am a little concerned about the finished projects format. I have looked at others from your previous site and feel that I need a little guidance concerning outline etc, but not the web page itself.
Jim_Levin: http://lrs.ed.uiuc.edu/students/YOUR-NETID/NEW-FILE.HTML
Jim_Levin: Oops, that didn't work. let me try again...
Jim_Levin: Well, ignore the line break.
Kim_Klein: where exactly do I enter that url?
Jim_Levin: Just type it into the "location" field at the top of Netscape or IE.
Jim_Levin: Paulette, you can put your files on any web server. The "look" of the page is up to you. Don't worry about what others look like.
Jim_Levin: But I'd be happy to look and give you feedback.
Jim_Levin: Kim, are you using Netscape or Internet Explorer?
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Kim_Klein: Thanks Jim,
Kim_Klein: I got it!
Jim_Levin: Great!
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Kim_Klein: Is there a better web page creator than netscape or expolorer that we have access to?
Kim_Klein: They both seem very limited
Jim_Levin: The other alternatives all cost $$s.
Debra_Bren: Jim, I tried to upload my eportfolio to correct an error and I keep getting kicked out of Netscape when I do it. It say that I've performed an illegal operation, you know the box with the red X. It seems like it was uploaded fine, but then when I open it again, the changes aren't made, even with refreshing the page.
Kim_Klein: Is there a way to load a calendar onto a page/
Jim_Levin: Some folks really like Claris Homepage; others like MS FrontPage. There are probably at least a dozen in wide use.
Kim_Klein: okay...thanks so much! All these questions relate to my major project-a class homepage.
Kim_Klein: Which should be up and running within the week!
Jim_Levin: Sometime Deb, there are mutliple copies of your file on your disk, and you're uploading the wrong one.
Kim_Klein: If I don't have any more crazy problems!
Jim_Levin: A calendar is just a table, Kim.
Kim_Klein: Thanks again!
Debra_Bren: Ok. I'll try to check that again.
Jim_Levin: Deb, do a search for the file name, and make sure you just have one (and the RIGHT one).
Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, Do you know when the digital video for this wseek's assignment will be ready for viewing? Also wanted to let you know that I went to the TechTv site and was fascinated with their online guides for web building, and the use of flash and animation. The instructions are easy and one can download Flash for 30 days for trial. It is amazing.
Jim_Levin: I keep waiting to hear myself when it will be ready. Soon I hope :-)
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Jim_Levin: I'll send Vanna email right after we're done here and ask.
Debra_Bren: Can you explain a little about Flash?
Jim_Levin: Flash is a "plug-in" which allows simple (cartoon-like) animations.
Jim_Levin: Since they're simple, they load really fast.
Debra_Bren: I'll have to give it a try.
Paulette_W: Debra, Go to shockwave.com, and you can see some examples of the way Flash is used.
Jim_Levin: That's the spirit!
Debra_Bren: Cool. All these neat things to try out!
Jim_Levin: The nice thing about technology - always new neat things to try out :-)
Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, should we go on to the Week 9 assignement?
Debra_Bren: :-)
Jim_Levin: Sure, go on ahead. I'll be posting the rest of the assignments, conferences, etc. shortly.
Paulette_W: Kim, concerning your question about web page software, I have used several and find Microsoft's Front Page to be the most user friendly.
Jim_Levin: I like Claris Homepage myself, but this is like asking "what's the best auto" or "which is the best pro football team"?
Jim_Levin: Check to see if you can get an educational discount on whichever you're interested in.
Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, you are obviously one of those MAC people. I agree it is the premium machine, but the problem is that most of us like the PC better.
Jim_Levin: Yes, I'm Mac and proud of it :-) But Homepage exists on both platforms.
Jim_Levin: Everytime I've tried Frontpage, I've had trouble creating a simple single page. It seemed to always want me to create a whole site.
Nelda_Bake: I have to go work, now.
Jim_Levin: One warning about Frontpage (and then I'll stop badmouthing the "Evil Empire")...
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Jim_Levin: If you use the graphic libraries, and then try to put your site on a Mac server (like the LRS), ...
Debra_Bren: Bye Nelda. Good luck.
Jim_Levin: it will have file names for the graphics that are too long for the Mac. So many of your graphic links will be broken.
Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, I probably have not encountered that problem because I have always created a whole site. I will look at it tomorrow to see if I can create a simple page. Your right about the MAC. It has more and greater capabilities.
Jim_Levin: Well, with the web, Paulette, platform becomes less and less important.
Jim_Levin: both Mac OS X and Windows 2000 look increasingly like web interfaces.
Jim_Levin: (and increasingly like each other :-)
Jim_Levin: Any other questions or issues or ...?
Debra_Bren: Are office hours still on for Thursday this week?
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Jim_Levin: Sure, I'll be here THursday (9pm CDT).
Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, that is good news. It should make it easier for all of us. No more questions. Signing off for now. Sorry about the spelling errors and using your for you're.
Jim_Levin: (when does Daylight time end?)
Jim_Levin: See you later Paulette.
Debra_Bren: Thanks for all your help Jim.Tell Sandy to take it easy. "CU" on Thursday!
Jim_Levin: okay, CU Thursday Deb.
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Paulette_W: Dr. Levin, You turn your clock back on the last Sunday of October.
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Jim_Levin: Hi Deb.
Deb: Hi Jim
Jim_Levin: Having problems with chat?
Deb: I didn't think so, but...it said I was already logged in, so I went out again and try to clear some things up.
Jim_Levin: How are things?
Deb: Good. I cleaned up my school web page - fixed the link and things should be okay now.
Jim_Levin: Great to hear. What's next?
Deb: I've been working on my project - slowly but surely.
Jim_Levin: Any barriers?
Deb: I don't think so - not so far anyway. Just time (as usual).
Jim_Levin: Everything else going okay? Did you see that the digital video powerpoint is ready?
Deb: I've been setting up the templates, filming book talks and having students work on presentations.
Deb: Yes - haven't had time to view it yet though. Tonight's work.
Jim_Levin: Sounds good. How are the students reacting?
Deb: Students are excited. Had local reps from libraries out today to conduct "book chats" with students and there was great dialogue. Hope it instills a "new" love for reading. You know that middle school age - nothing is "cool"
Jim_Levin: Sometimes doing the same old thing in a new medium gives new motivation.
Deb: I'd agree with that.
Jim_Levin: Would you like me to take a look at your templates?
Deb: That would be great. I should have them complete within the next couple of days. I will email themto you.
Jim_Levin: great - or you can just send me the URLs if they're on a server.
Deb: Ok
Jim_Levin: What are you going to do with the filmed book talks?
Deb: I'd like to include some of them on the web. I've sent out the permission forms, waiting for their return. I'd really like to have a variety of mediums out there for other students to view. My other thought is to dig out the Quick Cam to have student responses available. I'm also still toying with some interactive aspect.
Jim_Levin: Okay, with video, you'll need to think deeply about what's going to give you the most leverage, since its a whole new level of complexity and cost.
Deb: Could you explain further?
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Jim_Levin: Extra time to digitize and edit, extra cost of more hard disk space and digitizing equipment, extra time for users to wait for it to come across the internet.
Jim_Levin: etc.
Jim_Levin: Hi Tim.
Tim_Rogers: Hi All
Jim_Levin: How's you battle with the administration at your place going?
Jim_Levin: your battle
Tim_Rogers: I think I have them going with the flow now
Deb: You've given me some items to think further about. I'll keep you posted - with more questions too.
Deb: Thanks for the insight.
Jim_Levin: Hey, that's great! You'll have to document how that happened and share that with us sometime.
Tim_Rogers: They are letting me use the internet for the student to research articles and that is what I was after
Jim_Levin: Some of that is in vanna's digital video ppt, Deb.
Jim_Levin: That's an excellent place to start, Tim.
Deb: Great. I'm looking forward to viewing that tonight.
Jim_Levin: Note the two "glitches" in the video, Deb - I described them in my email.
Deb: Jim - do you know much about Mallard software? My school will be doing some initial high school online assessments with a feeder school. I got some of the information. It's developed from U of I.
Deb: BTW - Hi Tim!
Jim_Levin: Yes, Donna Brown, an Engineering prof, developed it. Its a "course package" system, sort of like Blackboard or WebCT or many others.
Jim_Levin: Makes it easier for a relatie novice to set up a course using the web.
Jim_Levin: relative novice
Deb: It appears user friendly. We will be using it to have students take their entrance math assessment for high school placement online from our site. The nea thing is that the assessment will be based on Il Learning standards and the data addresses information to be manipulated by benchmark attainment. I;m pretty excited about using it.
Jim_Levin: Let us all know how that goes? What's new in the Palm world?
Deb: I should work on my typing skills.
Jim_Levin: Hey, its readable - that's the main goal. :-)
*** Tim_Rogers has left channel #office-hours
Deb: "Palm" is being used. Can't drag it away from my daughter though.
Jim_Levin: You'll have to get your own.
Deb: I'm working on that. For all the meeting notes I take I think it would be so much easier in some respects. I carry this this thick planner around. That would help too.
Jim_Levin: Yes, especially with the neat folding keyboard - that makes taking notes really nice.
Deb: As far as discussion about the Palm use at the high school - some are very favorable, some aren't. I just had a converstaion with a dean yesterday. It's like any new technology - people see the hardware as the technology - not just as a tool to integrate the technology. I deal with that issue daily.
Jim_Levin: Yes, the key is how it's used, and how it fits into whatever else is going on.
Jim_Levin: (or doesn't fit :-)
Deb: The "tool" was initiated to improve Problem Based Learning integration.
Deb: I agree.
Jim_Levin: Does your daughter reports positive things in that area?
Deb: Yes. It's still in the initial "excitement" area, although she says it's great to "beam" lab notes to the rest of your group instead of making time to meet to do lab notes. She has also downloaded stuff from her home computer. She appears pretty proficient at it. She states that the use in school is ok. Some students made individual purchases and other use the school's. I did see a report on CNN news about our district Sat. Night. I showed some student
Deb: How's Sandy?
Jim_Levin: Better - she's off crutches/walker and now is hobbling around (can only put weight on the ball of her foot.
Jim_Levin: (is the ball the back part of the bottom of the foot?)
Deb: It just takes time. It gets a little better every day. That's good to hear.
Deb: I think the ball of the foot is more at the top, right under the toes.
Jim_Levin: Yes, but she's getting a bit stir crazy. Okay, she has to put weight only on the heel of her foot (that's the back part, right?)
Deb: Yep :)
Jim_Levin: On one hand its fortunately that she's just teaching an online course, since she can do that from home. On the other, it doesn't force her to go out.
Jim_Levin: fortunate
Deb: It's been beautiful out too. What a shame.
Jim_Levin: That's the way it goes. I keep giving her books and things about Hawaii (we're going there over New Years).
Deb: Her foot will be fine by then. How exciting.
Jim_Levin: That's why she had the operation done now.
Deb: That's good. She can enjoy all the nice weather there too, while we are sitting back here, probably in a foot of snow....
Jim_Levin: Hard to predict - they may have rain there while we have a mild winter here.
Deb: True
Jim_Levin: Any travel plans?
Deb: Nothing planned for this year yet. This is our year for fixing things in the house - 29 years old (new windows, bathroom remodeling, etc) Not as much fun as a vacation. I'm going to St. Louis next month for a conference though. A little change of scenery for a few days. Won't be as nice as my trip to San Diego last year for a workshop though. The weather there was beautiful.
Jim_Levin: San Diego is nice - we lived there before we came to Illinois 14 years ago.
Jim_Levin: Sandy wants to go back.
Deb: How lucky. I hadn't been there before - so it was a real treat for me.
Deb: Did you teach there also?
Jim_Levin: Did you get to the Zoo or the Wild Animal Park? Those are real highlights (beyond the nice weather and the beaches).
Jim_Levin: Yes, I taught at UCSD (Univ. of Calif, San Diego).
Deb: No. Not much sightseeing. All day software training on curriculum design for a week.
Jim_Levin: Did you get to the beach at least?
Deb: I think I'll have togo back there.
Jim_Levin: Definately :-)
Deb: Yes - beaches and walking in the sand were a must
Jim_Levin: (or should I say "for sure"
Deb: But that was able to be done at night - after training. Food was good too.
Jim_Levin: Good Mexican food, also seafood, Greek, Italian, etc.
Deb: yes
Jim_Levin: Let us know if you get out there again and we'll give some recommendations, since we get back there at least every other year.
Deb: That sounds great. I wish I was there walking on that beach now! Gotta run. Have another project to finish for tomorrow's meetings. Have a great weekend. I'll send you my project templates for feedback. You've given me some things to think about regarding my video possibilities and I feel I need to do more research before I attempt to finilize my outline. "CU" next chat!
Jim_Levin: Ok, CU later.
Deb: Bye Jim!